Fundraiser, Pure, Absolute Delight, & PZLDF Presentation
Oceans 13? Or, Feeling lucky? There’ll be a “Hold ‘Em for Shauna,” a Texas Hold’ Em poker party to raise money for Shauna Sullivan, who’s been working on behalf of the some of the Los Osos 45 (who have been targeted by the RWQCB, as well as the rest of the residents in the PZ who are also in their gun sights.) The competition event is being hosted by Developer Jeff Edwards and Julie Tacker. As listed in the recent Bay News, “ . . .they will host the event at their residence. They will provide transportation to their home via limo from the Sea Pines Golf Resort. Buy-in is $100 and includes transportation, chips and buffet. Spectators pay $15. All contributions are tax deductible. For further info, see the Web site at BOFFO@INFOSTATIONS.com or call 528-8736 for ticket information.
Take a Break From Sewers, Time For Some Pure Delight
As noted in the Bay News, “Organizers of the California International Choral Festival & Competition, the first and only choir competition of its kind in the U.S., are ready to welcome seven international and U.S. Choirs to San Luis Obispo for a 3-day festival from June 29 through July 1 at the Performing Arts Center at Cal Poly.
“The event will feature a celebration of song that includes classical and native folk pieces. The Festival is the dream and vision of its Artistic Director, Gary Lamprecht, founder of the San Luis Obispo Vocal Arts Ensemble. An honored and dedicated choral music teacher, Lamprecht has toured extensively with the Vocal Arts Ensemble throughout Europe and competed to international acclaim. The Ensemble hosts the 3-day event.”
In addition to the scheduled events at the PAC, some of which are free, there will be a variety of other performances all over town at various churches, at the SLO Thursday night Farmer’s Market and other venues. For further information, call Pat Harris at 552-0455 or check out the website at www.CaliforniaChoral.org.
For those of you familiar with the wonderful SLO Vocal Arts Choir, this is a truly exciting event, not to be missed. Enough with sewers; time for a song.
Meeting Announcement
PZLDF’s guest speaker is from Lombardo & Associates. If you’re interested in getting more information on decentralized plans, onsite plans etc. here’s a chance to come and ask questions.
CITIZENS FOR CLEAN WATER
PROHIBITION ZONE LEGAL DEFENSE FUND
dedicated to clean water, regulatory compliance
and protection of property rights
www.pzldf.org
WASHINGTON MUTUAL BANK COMMUNITY ROOM
6:00 PM
For more details, please call 534-1913 or 528-0229
GUEST SPEAKER
Pio Lombardo
Lombardo & AssociatesDecentralization Benefits, Costs & Considerations
Learn about compliance alternatives – and how they promote a sustainable future
What are the benefits of decentralized systems? What’s the technology? What about the costs?
How does a decentralized approach fit into the mix of options?
What is the permitting process for alternative systems?
How does it address environmental issues?
What are the community impacts and opportunities?
Keep up with the Enforcement Status that will affect your Property and Future
ccw-PZLDF does not endorse the sewer site, technology, or costs, but seeks to assure all options are considered to achieve a open public process, an informed citizenry, and un coerced vote.
CCW-PZLDF
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Calhoun's Can(n)ons was originally published in 1990 in the (now defunct) Morro Bay, CA, Sun Bulletin, and since 1992 has continued in the various resurrections of the Los Osos, CA. Bay News, Bay Breeze, Bay News, Bay News-Tolosa Press. A few years ago, the Can(n)on was added to the Central Coast NewsMission blogsite. Ann Calhoun lives in Los Osos. You can email her at Churadogs at gmail dot com
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59 comments:
Let's hope the DA doesn't get wind of the illegal poker game at jeff Edwards.
Tax deductable? You sure?
PLEASE, say it ain't so..C.C & G.B.McP doing a "NON-PROFIT" benefit together. Could get a little NASTY, given both their "personality" defects! And to make things even more DICEY, Jeff-Boy & Julie have PUBLICLY ANNOUNCED their COZY LIVING ARRANGEMENT! Does anyone besides me see a CONFLICT OF INTEREST HERE?
Just what is the Riverside Queen of Mean up to with this LATEST STUNT? Everyone who's been here any length of time at all, knows that B.O.F.F.O is the "NON-PROFIT" that C.T.C. uses. But for what?
On to other things now, did everyone receive their "glossy new edition" of the Los Osos Wastewater Project? Well, open it up to the last sentence on page 5...Seems as though the State Water Board is still holding the axe over everyone's head. It's clear they're still trying to manipulate the prop. 218 vote with yet another threat...NO GRANTS UNLESS THE 218 PASSES. Now, how's THAT for ELECTIONEERING, Ms. Churadogs?
Let's not have one sewer in the "middle" of town - let's research having five or six all over town.
What a waste of time.
Why not just ask the CSD to fund the whole sheebang????
They can affort to pay $17,000 monthly salary for a Interiem GM???? But that will be cut back when she goes part-time in July, but she’ll still earn $110 an hour!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
WHAT IN THE HELL IS THAT CSD DOING???????????????????????
Fold the tent folks, I am more than pissed at that revelation and will formaly protest ANY of my property tax dollars going to anything related to this farce of a government!!!!!!!!!!!!
$204,000 a year????
TWO HUNDRED FOUR THOUSAND DOLLARS!!!!
ou like to ruin Ann's site, just like you like to ruin Los Osos (putting an ugly smelly sewer in the heart of town and forcing working families and seniors out.)
You like to ruin. Ruin is your favorite new word. It's very clear by what you just did. That's what Taxpayers Watch does.
THIS SAYS WHO YOU ARE AND WHY WE SHOULD VOTE NO -- AGAINST YOU AND TAXPAYERS WATCH!
Why don't you go back to your lame friends back at the Trib site?!
< phew >
For those of us with a broken scroll bar that last one was brutal. Please, was all of that really necessary? I kinda got the drift of your statement along about the 20th screech. So, uh, you think we should pass the 218 and build the sewer - any sewer, at any cost, in any location, using any design technology - now? Whether it solves any of our real world problems or not? Cool. (Note: Politics and bureaucratic ego's are not real world problems. These are fabrications. Real world problems are pollution & potable water.)
Now, on to the curiously important stuff. A Texas Hold Em poker party at Jeff and Julie's place? A $100 tax-deductible buy-in with chips and buffet? Holy Cow, don'tcha just *LOVE* Los Osos!!!!
don'tcha just *LOVE* Los Osos!!!!
don'tcha just *LOVE* Los Osos!!!!
don'tcha just *LOVE* Los Osos!!!!
don'tcha just *LOVE* Los Osos!!!!
don'tcha just *LOVE* Los Osos!!!!
don'tcha just *LOVE* Los Osos!!!!
Sorry, my keyboard stuck.
don'tcha just *LOVE* Los Osos!!!!
Dang!
Hemlock cocktail anyone? Sadly, I'm a terrible poker player. I do love craps though. I'm a terrible craps player too but some things ya just gotta love despite their flaws. And craps only seems appropriate, no? Any chance of getting a craps game going?
Which only leads me to ask the obvious: Why stop there? Ya wanna collect some serious money for Shauna Sullivan - let's not get into the why's and wherefore's now - open up some pool betting. And some over and under's. Like, will the 218 Vote - whatever it may be - pass or fail? $25/chit. Or pick a day/year the sewer will 'Officialy' be opened. The date closests to, but not over, wins. $25/pick. Bet early (and often) to get the best date(s). Now that would generate some serious money, eh? And some wonderful long term interest. Final Four eat your heart out.
Dear Sharky and Maria,
First it was Doug Morin, now it's Crapkiller and Taxpayers Watch vandalizing Ann's site, you two pretend to be moderates even though we believe you're agents of Taxpayers Watch. If you are not Taxpayers Watch and you claim you're working for the good of the community, then why can't you reel in these rogue elements of your own people. If you can't control them, they will help defeat the 218 vote by turning off anyone who is sitting on the fence. After witnessing this shameful act of suppression of free speech, I tend to believe that voting against the 218 and keeping people like this on the side of the road, is the best option for Los Osos.
I advise you to do something about the sick members of Taxpayers Watch and their destructive agenda.
P.S. Paavo, are you taking notes?
How about YOU doing something about a GD $204,000 year employee?
That is absolutely beyond any realm of reality!!!!!!!!!!
I don't belong to the Tax Payers Watch, but I sure am joining them this afternoon!!!!!!!
I advise you to do something about the sick members of Taxpayers Watch and their destructive agenda.
This coming from a guy who wrote:
"Take every single Dreamer and Taxpayers Watch member on a bus ride to Mexico, dig some shallow graves, and tell them to get on their knees and pray that God will forgive them in the end."
Why don't you give it a rest Conspiracy Boy. You're a dumbshit. We know it. You know it.
PG, 2-1 odds Conspiracy Boy thinks I'm a county employee who gets paid to sit here all day and blog. You know, to sway the 218 vote and all.
Yes indeed, like Randy newman says....I LOVE LO!!!!!!!!
pg-13 (Richard LeGros): I don't think Ann Coulter was referring to John Edwards as a "faggot" since that term is only reserved for you.
What a dumbshit. Obviously the homophobic obstructionist has never spent any time around these blogs, for he certainly would know PG-13 if he did.
What a dope. What a dumbshit. And honest to God my guess is he's gay and hasn't come to terms with it. The Gay Sexually Confused obstruciontist. I LOVE LO!!!!!!!
pretty sick and certainly not true, but typical of the attacks by desperate people about to have a sewer rammed up their ass.
You lost the community's respect for your activism! You are only a hand wringing Dumbshit Obstructionist!
What stupid asses you are all: Gordo, your dad(Jimmy),LeGross, Pandora, Jerry, Leon, Arcuni, Fredricks,Albright, etc. etc.etc
It's disappointing to see how democracy has been boiled down to anonymous mud slinging and vandalism.
When Ann Calhoun posts articles on her blog, she does this as a service for the community. Whether or not you agree with what she writes, she's communicating to the masses, partaking in a democracy that is now sinking deeper and deeper into the Morro Bay Estuary.
I understand that there is a point to posting anonymously on the blog--as I am posting anonymously myself--but one can easily forget accountability. When you vandalize sites with the same message posted a hundred times, you're mocking the privilege of being anonymous; you're taking a discussion and turning it into a cowardly rant that will only hurt you and the people that supposedly support your rants.
It's gone beyond the point of telling you to stop. It's gone beyond the point of telling you to behave. You won't listen. You won't sit down and listen to what the community has to say.
You [referring to "you" as in the Taxpayers Watch] have severe humanitarian and civil rights issues. Ann Calhoun used the Tom Wolfe "mao-mao," which is mildly put. Using Doug Morin's own words: you are Jihadists fighting for a deeply flawed belief and in your fight for Tri-W and gravity collection, you hurt the people in the process. You chose Los Osos to be your battlegrounds for your apocalyptic desires.
Every day, you challenge an already divided community into a mud slinging battle. You are at the brinkmanship of war, simply put, and in this case, I don't need evidence of WMDs to prove that you are terrorists.
I'd rather be a "dumbshit obstructionist" than openly belonging to an organization that obstructs from the law or being someone that proudly breaks the law for the sake of a dumb idea.
Sharon Fredericks has nothing better to do with her time.
I have a good idea on how to handle this manner creatively:
I'd like someone to print out this page (or at least an excerpt). All you have to do is press Ctrl+P, select your printer and voila! It's quite simple.
Print out any of the other comment pages as well. Make a bunch of Xerox copies at Copy Spot, ASAP or Kinkos and assemble a packet with a front cover that reads, "This is what the Taxpayers Watch actually believe," set it on the counter at every CSD meeting, every BOD meeting, every TAC meeting and raise everyone's awareness on how absurd these people are.
Their actions definitely speak louder than words. They've already failed in the "word" department.
"I'd rather be a "dumbshit obstructionist" than openly belonging to an organization that obstructs from the law or being someone that proudly breaks the law for the sake of a dumb idea"
Go back to school and learn to make complete, rational statements. THEN compare the "proudly" defying laws by this CSD to TW following the laws to challege an unconstitutional Measure B. Compare this CSD PAYING an attorney to represent a small number in sueing the RWQCB!
And how can a BANKRUPT CSD pay a temporary employee $17,000 per month???????????
And people wonder why others call Los Osos residents crazy!
We need to acheive credibility with the RWQCB, the courts, and the County Board of Supervisors. How does this nonsense help that effort in any way?
I hate to say this because I tend to be one of the more verbose commentors on this blog. I hate to think about how many long-winded comments I've suffered the rest of you to read. Sorry about that. But one anon seems to think poisoning the well is the best way to express his/her feelings. We can hope s/he get bored and go find another way to entertain themselves. Some ideas come to mind but me, being *pg-13, I can't even suggest things like that ;-)
And no silly goose, I am most certainly NOT Richard LeGros. I'm sure Richard will be weighing in shortly emphasizing that same point.
Well said PG. I can't help but think something very strange happened here, and it happened right at the time Ann wrote her column about Al Barrow and his travails with the CSD last month. I'm not saying this person posting here is Barrow, but something is odd about the appearance of this extremely odd person and that column. Anyway, I have better things to do than read the crap on here. Stay informed Los Osos. And support the county process. It's all we have and I think our last, best chance.
Ann, why not just turn off the comments section for a few days and see if that gets rid of the idiots.
Who the heck is Doug Moron? (oops I mean Morin)
If you are going to put Cesena's name up there a million times at the very least you could spell it right, you dummy.
It looks like to me that someone posing as a TW supporter is doing so in an attempt to continue to keep the focus on TW instead of other more important issues.
Bingo
Yup I agree.
Sorry Mike Green, the community has incubated a few too many activists who have laid the ground work for obstructionism as their "Right". It now seems some pro-Tri-W and/or pro-any-sewer folks are fed up with the obstruction by the anti-Tri-W folks.
I'm not real fond of the Orenco/Obstructionist Boy, but unless someone who knows him can have a Come-to-Jesus meeting with him, we'll either have to tolerate his non-factual nonsense and that would mean putting up with the pro-folks ire also. An other alternative is to get out of the blog business and have a dual in front of Von's at high noon! Oh wait, that's scheduled for December 12.
December 11: Target date for County Clerk to announce official prop 218 results.
Guess we have to put up with the PreSchool dumbshits till then.
The members of Taxpayers Watch, despite villification, have always been courtious. It seems like this is a frame attempt against Taxpayers Watch (representing the property owners) by some ONE individual with a very week mind, lack of self control, an anger management problem, and certainly no respect for the law, or the county process. Probably a renter, perhaps not: Definitely deranged and separated from reality.
I support Taxpayers Watch because they support the county process and work in the best interest of the property owners who WILL pay the bills.
I want the best sewer available, care not where it is, or what system, at the best price so I pay the least that I have to, and do not have to pay an exorbitant price for discharge permits, or have to put renters on the street. I do not want to see those retired individuals on fixed income who have lived in their homes for many years forced to leave because of an unfunded mandate. It is all about money for me. Not stink, not location, not mega sewer, not step/steg, not gravity, not cluster sewers, not ponding system, not conventional plant, not viewshed, just money for a project that will get the job done, and help our water situation BEFORE I get hammered by the government which cares not for individuals, but only for the "greater good". I am well on record for this.
To Mike Green: The idiots will not go away. They have a vested interest that any sewer NOT be built. They do not understand that it is almost impossible to fight "city hall" because "city hall" has unlimited resources and they have few resources. Hence the NO on the 218 Vote effort. This thing has been going on for 30 years, and they do not understand the nature of a mandate. They do not understand the power of regulating authorities, with the full power of the state and law behind them. Los Osos is a piss ant compared to the will of the state, along with Fed and state anti polution laws, and the regulating boards placed to enforce them.
I do not work for the county, as I have been accused (probably by a single fool). I want them to work for ME, and that is their job. If you want them to work for you, send them a maximum campaign contribution. Money talks, bullshit walks. It has always been this way. If you want good government, expect to pay for it. This is reality.
This blog is monitored by many in government with no row to hoe. You have seen comments by Noel King on this blog. Anything written that
makes no sense, or the actions above, reinforces the idea that there are "nut cases" in Los Osos. Anyone who gets up at a BOS meeting, and spouts foolishness is seen as a fool, especially those who keep asking the same questions when the questions have already been answered. All government agencies keep themselves fully informed as to what is going on here. They read, comprehend, and are only concerned with factual information. "Beliefs" are reserved for religion. We have a public works project going on here.
Sorry it took ALL the time to get through the repetitious obstruction above. I hope those who pay the price to go to the Tacker/Edwards benefit for Sullivan at a multi million dollar house up in Cabrillo consider why the money is being spent and for whose benefit. (Sullivan).
If those who GO have a feeling that their money is well spent, and there is a possibility of success, have fun. At least you will get to see how a very wealthy man and his girl friend live.
See if he uses plastic plates and utensils. I have a feeling he will be hiding the sterling silverware and fine china. It would be wise.
Annajane Hugh is whinning that her $17,000 monthly salary will be cut back when she goes part-time in July, but she’ll still earn $110 an hour. It's still $204,000 annually!!!!!!!
HOW MUCH DO YOU MAKE?????
HOW ABOUT THESE ELECTED OFFICIALS??????
Salaries of Elected State Officials
Established By The
California Citizens Compensation Commission ---------------------------------
Class
Code
Elected Officials Monthly
Salary Annual
Salary
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
5309 Governor $17,681.56 $212,179
5316 Lieutenant Governor $13,261.17 $159,134
5695 Attorney General $15,358.43 $184,301
5319 Secretary of State $13,261.17 $159,134
4189 Controller $14,145.25 $169,743
4232 Treasurer $14,145.25 $169,743
2545 Superintendent of Public Instruction $15,358.43 $184,301
4393 Insurance Commissioner $14,145.25 $169,743
4273 Members, Board of Equalization $13,261.17 $159,134
0000 Speaker of the Assembly & President Pro Tem of the Senate $11,136.56 $133,639
0000 Minority Floor Leader $11,136.56 $133,639
0000 Majority Floor Leader $10,410.29 $124,923
0000 Second Ranking Minority Leader $10,410.29 $124,923
0000 All Legislators $9,684.01 $116,208
HOW IN HELL CAN A BANKRUPT LOCSD AFFORD TO PAY AN EMPLOYEE $17,000 A MONTH?????????????????????????
Ann or maybe Ron, PLEASE take a crack at 'splain'n how that can be allowed? How many bids were taken or was interim general with as a sole source AND WHY????? Please wade in, this is a very big deal!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
To anon 7:25 PM:
This is the same sort of stuff that has gone on with this recall board. Wil-Dan, Julie Hayward Biggs/Briggs and her law firm, and now an attempt to feather Sullivan's nest. Add this to money out the window to Ripley and the Piranha manufacturer (if they got paid). All because they stopped a sewer with no "due diligence" and no plan, and wished to cover their rears at the expense of the district and property owners.
Ain't heard any logical 'splain'n yet!
Hey! Insolvency and bankruptcy is a VERY BIG DEAL!
Of course at this point in time, nobody is going to work for the LOCSD without money UP FRONT.
However, the bankruptcy judge may demand that the money be returned and put back into the pot to be spread about ALL creditors.
And they continue to spend money on Shauna Sullivan, without any documentation on billable hours or who she is even speaking with (the CSD or PZLDF). And are we sure they are not paying for PZLDF's share as well? This is one time I actually agree with Keith Swanson and Richard Margetson. Questions, questions.
Crapkiller,
Thank you Taxpayers Watch for ruining Ann's site. You obviously don't want ANY opposition. You tell everyone it's only "conspiracy boy" and now you say that you don't care where and what kind of sewer when you've promoted Tri-W/gravity daily (hourly) You are a liar. When you lie once, you'll lie again.
Anyone who votes yes on the 218 might as well just sign their property over to the county because when the county is done with all their assessments, fees, charges, fines, whatever your home equity will be zero.
The county has made it clearer every day that they want our homes (land) and they're going to get it one way or another with the helpful hand of their kissing cousins the State & Regional Water board.
That may be okay for you, but not for me, and as time goes on the property owners are starting to see the truth. The truth always comes out sooner or later, but it comes out. You can count on that crapkiller!
To the old hag at 3:30 PM,
That's irrelevant. I said this before and I'll say it again: I rather be a "dumbshit obstructionist" than be a member of a deeply flawed, law-avoiding organization OR be someone who breaks the law for the sake of a dumb idea. What's so difficult to understand about that? Take accountability.
To Richard LeGros at 3:58 PM,
Get over yourself.
We're not sure of anything this CSD has done financially for the past 18 months!
Hey Dumbshit Obstructionist
Put your sorry ass on the line and explain how legal the CSD is in paying $110 /hr to a temp employee
To whoever uses the term "Conspiracy (Orenco) Boy":
I find your efforts at trying to devalue community member input is laughable at best for a number of reasons. Calling someone "Conspiracy Boy," "Orenco Boy," Joey or Al is a simple euphoric joust, which shields you of actually having to explain yourself. What would the world be coming to if irrationality was explained?
You guys have nothing to say, nothing to show.
To our anonymous friend of 1:20pm, 3:33pm and 3:44pm ...
If you would grow the hell up and put your comment in once or twice it would make it a lot easier for the rest of us who want to read what folks write here.
No offense, but are you stupid or do you just act that way?
To 4crapkiller:
Let me introduce to you my complete refutation of all of your posts. Heck, I don't even need to quote you. I won't dignify your words with any sort of reflection.
Your logic is flawed, as usual.
Anybody who disagrees with you or Taxpayers Watch is has a "very weak [sic] mind, lack of self control, an anger management problem, and certainly no respect for the law, or the county process." You think you know, but you have no idea, or maybe you do--but you just can't accept it so you feel compelled to diagnose and vilify the unknown. Brilliant!
You want the best sewer available (or the money for one, at least) but then again, you support an obsolete wastewater treatment facility that is frowned upon by prominent wastewater engineers in the nation as well as the world. You don't want the working class to leave because of an unfunded mandate, but you support the $250+/month sewer bill that would be too much of a cost to bear for anyone with a fixed income or anyone who's retired. Brilliant!
Nowadays, only Sharon is the one who vocalizes about people being anti-sewer or having a "vested interest" in any sewer not being built. That's quite a strawman which you never proved. I asked you time and time again to rationalize that statement, but no, no follow-up. Nada. The truth is that people want a sewer, which is affordable and efficient. The truth is that Los Osos needs a sewer. The truth is that you really don't give a damn what the truth really is.
To Gary Karner at 8:46 PM:
This is what you've made. This is who you support. They may be idiots or perhaps an "anonymous" friend to you, but in the end, they're still your friend.
Annajane is a contract employee. Interesting that the anti-sole source Board issued the interim GM contract without going out to bid
How about that Ann??
If Joyce Albright or anyone who knows her reads this blog, you should know that her rental house in the PZ is pathetic. The tenants are loud, dirty, foul, and probably involved in the CJS. The neighborhood was clean and quiet and folks TRUSTED their neighbors before those tenants moved in. Several of us have gotten into the habit of calling the Sheriff to check on things in our block. Why do you rent to people like this?
sigh
CrapKiller,
It WAS YOU who repeated the same over and over on this site today.
First you posted the same lines out of the Tribune's story on the CSD GM on the Tribune's story blog at around 8AM and you posted several times in a row. Soon you came to Ann's and repeated, and repeated, and repeated.
It's YOU. You post from 6AM to 9PM on every single site you can. Do you stop for lunch?...doesn't look like it.
You are one sick puppy, and you are Taxpayers Watch telling us to vote yes. How can anyone in their right mind listen to a word you say?
One crapkiller can spell and one can't...hummm....
P.S. I heard Joyce Albright also owns at least one vacant lot...hummmm....
Thank God 4Crapkiller goes to bed early. This poor blog needs a break, it's had a rough day...poor Ann has to clean all 4Crapkiller's stuff up in the morning....fun...
4Crapkiller is like a gang member tagging Ann's site -- nice huh? An animal marking their territory.
I'll vote "no" because 4Crapkiller says to vote "yes"!
Anonymous said 10:46 PM, June 22, 2007 ..."I'll vote "no" because 4Crapkiller says to vote "yes"!"
County Lies + Taxpayers Hate + Fate = 218 Collapse + Hope (Finally)
So if CK says she is going to live in Los Osos FOREVER, then you will move away SOON????
To our anonymous friend of 8:53pm on June 22
I don't support idiocy ... I try to be all about clarity of thought.
However, you do have a good point. Perhaps it would be best to give corrections to one's own side.
Much like I tried to tell our horribly repetitive friend off, you might want to correct those on your side who are rude or toss out unsupported statements as fact.
ps - I'm not Gary. Maybe you missed my earlier comment on that. I also find it funny and am somewhat saddened by the continual guessing game about who is who (for example, calling Franc3 "Julie") and insisting on continuing that practice even when told that the guess is incorrect. If it doesn't help the discussion of the facts or promote healing of our community ... and if it detracts from building bridges between one side and the other ... it should not be done.
Sharkinlet:
I've been reading your posts for some time, both here and on the Tribunes blog.
At first you seem fair, but sooner or later you always come back to "cheerleading" the Tri-W gravity project, you say,..."show me out of town is cheaper"..etc. etc. ...talk about repetitive! Just like 4crapkiller did yesterday to this site, you repeat the same over and over. It is boring! Your facts and figures come from Richard LeGros and/or the county. Hey, the experts had something to say about the county's numbers too! Personally, from what I've seen, I think you are as phoney as 4crapkiller.
Healing of the community? When you support the county who will have liens on our homes and if we can't pay, the county can take our homes from us in less than 5 years?
This first 218 assessment will appear on the property tax bill soon after the 218 vote and way before a project starts?!?
You support a project that is so expensive we are simply being ripped off period! You can not tell us that there isn't technology that is better and cheaper. Heck, there is grant money for things like wetland projects and using wind, etc. for energy. Why are you opposed to REAL alternatives?
The State Water board "HOPES" that a sewer will help nitrates. That's what they said. Is that not a fact?
Morro Bay has higher nitrates. Is that not a fact? The bay has many, many polluters, but they want to blame septics for the pollution, is that not a fact? The RWQCB has not proved that any of the CDO homes are (individually) polluting, is that not a fact? The RWQCB has abused their power, and Mr. Young admitted that he LIKES BEING CALLED A TERRORIST, is that not a fact?
Mr. Blakeslee sold AB2701 by stating that ALL 5,000 septics were polluting, is that not a fact? The county has said this is ONLY THE FIRST ASSESSMENT, is that not a fact? The county could have an advisory survey before the 218 if they wanted to, is that not a fact?...heck it's just a survey! We will never know the true cost of the sewer before they have us vote, is that not fact? The 218 vote is for an unknown project, is that not a fact? Sam Blakeslee wanted to have ONLY the PZ homeowners to pay for the $41 million CSD debt, is that not a fact? Paavo said at the first Town Hall meeting that everyone would pay with special or general benefits, then changed his mind and is having only the PZ pay now, is that not a fact? No matter what the county says now, the BOS can pick a project for us, is that not a fact? Noel King, Shirley, the RWQCB have all stated their preference for Tri-W, is that not a fact? The RWQCB has not been, "fair, firm, or consistant" with their enforcement actions which they HAVE to do, is that not a fact?
Oh, Sharkinlet and 4Crapkiller -- we do have facts, and too many to list today on this site (yesterday was a killer thanks to crapkiller.)
You act as if you know everything about everything yet you never supported any alternative project that this town could afford.
That's right, "something the town could afford" and YOU CAN NOT TELL US THAT COULD NOT BE DONE!!!
Too many experts (including Dr. T) do not think that Tri-W and gravity is the best solution for Los Osos. When we tell you that, you want facts and more facts and documention on the facts.
You and 4crapkiller simply know more than the experts who write the books on sewers. Come on, admit it!
Someone said, " So if CK says she is going to live in Los Osos FOREVER, then you will move away SOON???? "....
Crapkiller has said that she DOESN'T LIVE IN LOS OSOS. She said she had rental property.
Crapkiller won't be here to suffer in hell during the construction of big pipes 20 feet down into the ground either!
To our friend of 12:27pm ...
If it feels to you like I am a cheerleader for TriW I apologize. However, it should be noted that no one has stepped forward to explain or show how alternatives to TriW would be cheaper (as has often been claimed).
If my criteria for which project is best heavily weights the cost aspect it should be no surprise that I would like TriW. Simply put, no one besides me, Richard, the County and Ripley have put numbers out there. Three of the four sets of analyses essentially agree. Ripley stands out as different and it likely is because they're comparing the costs in a very different way than anyone else. (For example, their proposed treatment plant could handle about 50 gallons per person per day but TriW could handle twice that and they didn't incorporate inflation into their cost estimates.)
On another issue, all of my cost estimates are my own and not based on what Richard or the County has presented. If you were wise, you would trust them over me because they are far more careful than I am and more knowledgeable as well.
If you don't like my repetitive refrain about "what's it gonna cost?" and "how do we know that your hopeful plan will really be less expensive?" and the like, you know how to shut me up ... just explain how Orenco will really save us money or just put out your own numbers which make sense.
As I've always said, the moment someone out there comes up with an out of town plan that will quite likely save us over TriW as already designed ... I'll switch gears.
Now let's get to the other issues you raise. Lots of them are good discussion fodder.
About healing the community and the County and liens and the like ... I am unsure what you mean, but I'll take a guess. I'll support the County because no one else now would seem to be legally allowed to develop a treatment plant and if we vote no on a 218 vote, I think that things will be even worse. A bankrupt CSD ... even if they did have a cheaper idea ... couldn't pull it off ... they're too focused on other things. Also (to repeat an often repeated refrain), no other plan has been shown to be cheaper.
Why would a 218-based tax assessment appear before the project starts? Because that is now what has to happen because of the LOCSD/SWRCB/SRF fiasco. Once the LOCSD decided it was best to stiff the state, the State would now require a 218 vote before any SRF loan. Similarly, due to a desire to avoid LOTA-type lawsuits, an assessment will be used rather than a service fee. Having an actual revenue stream will allow the County to buy bonds to start the design/permitting/building right away. The SWRCB/SRF deal was a sweet one ... an unsecured loan that didn't have to be paid back until after the sewer was online. This is yet another unintended consequence of Los Osos past actions (the LOTA lawsuit and the stopping of TriW).
I'll reject your statement that we're being ripped off until you show me how we can save money (and still meet state requirements). From my point of view, the people who have already ripped us off are those who have taken actions which have made the project (any project) so expensive that many cannot afford it. Who would I blame? At least CASE and CCLO come to mind because both groups were instrumental in stalling the project between 2002 and 2005 which essentially raised the cost. Some would also blame the Solutions Group for proposing something that they should have known wouldn't fly. However the key point is this ... past decisions have caused our costs to be higher today.
About nitrates. We know that when homes are sewered they don't put nitrates into the groundwater. We also know that when the density of septic systems is low enough (about one home per acre), the nitrates are converted into fertilizer before they make it into the groundwater. Will a sewer lower our nitrates? The argument that the nitrates should go down is pretty solid.
Of your other issues in the nitrates paragraph, I'll address some but not all (for lack of time). If you want to think of the RWQCB as unjustified and mean ... go ahead ... but they still seem to have the legal authority and I won't advocate fighting them unless it is highly likely to reduce our bills which seems unlikely to me.
Should just the PZ pay for the debt of the LOCSD? I would seem to me that the LOCSD as a whole ought to pay that debt. After all, some of the votes for recall came from Cabrillo and from Bayview Heights ... those neighborhoods along with East of South Bay Blvd are just as much a part of the LOCSD as anyone else. I haven't seen any information that suggests Blakeslee wanted only the PZ to pay the LOCSD debts. (I can see why some would make that argument ... after all it is mostly people in the PZ who are highly involved in the sewer issue ... but to me it seems quite unsound.) Even so, the best and cheapest solution might be to wrap the state debts (the RWQCB fines and the SWRCB loan debts) into a new County-based SRF loan. Without these debts being taken care of, we'll not get a low interest loan and without a low interest loan, the total amount we'll be paying will be much much more than what we currently owe the state.
Do I think it fair to have only the PZ pay for the sins of the LOCSD as a whole? No. Is it a good idea? If we can save on our bills, yes.
As to your facts ... the ones that are too many to mention ... I would appreciate it if you would put them out here ... may be a few at a time ... so that we can think them over and figure out whether we want to change our minds on these issues or not.
Affordability has come and gone. That was years ago when we rejected the County plan at about $100/month. (Even that seemed high to me.) But since then the costs have only gone up and up. To delay the project to make it more affordable only makes it far more unaffordable. Why would I not support an alternative to TriW? I would if only one were less expensive. Show me one that is and I'll support it!
As for your suggestion that I only ask for facts and documentation to back up your point of view ... did you want us all to just trust you because you are anonymous and chock-full-of-truth? I (and I suspect many people) would only want to adopt a new point of view if it were justified and explained. For me the selling point is clear ... just tell me how I'll save money for a project that is about as good or a bit better.
As for whether I know more than the Ripley folks (or whomever you refer to) ... I don't. However I do know that what they proposed isn't comparable to TriW at all and yet they told us that it was. Asking questions shouldn't be confused with acting like an expert.
Perhaps if the experts that you seem to think are on your side were to explain how we'll save money with an alternative location and STEP it would be nice.
A refreshing change, in fact.
Thank you ANN for cleaning up the site from the actions of frustrated, distructive, bloggers.
Sharkey,
In a properly working septic system, the nitrates are converted to free nitrogen, before they enter an aquifer. This is done by anaerobic bacteria working with a carbon source at a minimum distance of about 30 ft from the leach field to the aquifer.
Aerobic bacteria converts urine to ammonia to nitrite and then to nitrate in a septic tank. There is very little anaerobic bacteria in a septic tank to convert nitrate to free nitrogen.
Nitrate is fertilizer.
and just what is the carbon source in the Los Osos sand? How much carbon is required for the conversion of 2 liters urine per day?
Thank you Ann for disabling anonymous posting. If anyone wants to post anonymously, they can at my blog.
Crapkiller ...
What you say is right ... except that this conversion doesn't work if the conversion system is overloaded ... in other words, it only works well if the density is low enough.
To shark inlet:
You are correct but see below.
To anon: 2:33 PM June 23
Please excuse the lateness of the reply, I had to get a blogger account.
The problem with our sand, besides the high density of housing, is that it has very little, almost no carbon in it.
HOWEVER. If with four houses per acre with 30 ft of separation from the water table, the injection of ethanol (grain alcohol) or methanol (wood alcohol/shellac thinner) into the effluent would supply the necessary carbon source for our sand. This is done at wastewater treatment plants into arrays of coffins containing anaerobic bacteria to produce tertiary treatment.
The equivelent of one quart of vodka 100 proof or one pint of methanol per week for a family of four should do the job depending upon water use and amount of urine.
It would have to be injected slowly between the septic tank and the leach field and the quantity injected would depend upon effluent flow.
A quart of cheap vodka would cost about $8 a week, a pint of methanol about the same, but the injector equipment and water monitoring equipment would cost many thousands, and any leaky septic tank would have to be replaced regardless.
As the law now stands this would be an illegal discharge. It also has nothing to do with a mandated sewer system. However it would work. It is fine to use this in a treatment plant.
I hope I have answered your question. I may not be exact about the quantity needed. You would have to get full information about the chemical usage from a sewer plant operator based upon their flows of effluent treated.
There is a lot of information about nitrate removal from water on the internet.
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